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	<title>Comments on: Another whingeing Catholic demands more respect for Christianity</title>
	<atom:link href="http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/</link>
	<description>The voice of atheism since 1881</description>
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		<title>By: remigius</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14308</link>
		<dc:creator>remigius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 01:45:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14308</guid>
		<description>I must admit that I have been moved by Julie Axe&#039;s words..

...&#039;Had it not been for my faith in God, I would probably ended up a basket case&#039;. 

I tried so hard to empathise with her, to put myself in her position. But upon reading this I laughed so hard I did a little pee.

Lesson learned. Those who are beyond help are beyond help.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I must admit that I have been moved by Julie Axe&#8217;s words..</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8217;Had it not been for my faith in God, I would probably ended up a basket case&#8217;. </p>
<p>I tried so hard to empathise with her, to put myself in her position. But upon reading this I laughed so hard I did a little pee.</p>
<p>Lesson learned. Those who are beyond help are beyond help.</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Axe</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14290</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Axe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 22:21:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14290</guid>
		<description>Barry,

This is your blog and I will respect your decision that I leave and not return.  But, sir, you are very mistaken about Mother Theresa (spelled several ways due to the area one is coming from).  I know FIRST HAND of the works of Mother.  You depend upon what you read in the secular paper rather going to India yourself and witness FIRST HAND.  If you went during her time, you would have been awe struck.  This is not something I read about...THIS IS WHAT I HAD THE PRIVILEGE TO WITNESS!  My eyes were not deceived and the witness testimony of many who she had comforted, are you telling me that they lied to me?

Again, before I leave, I want to thank all who I had an open and honest dialog with.

Peace and good bye!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barry,</p>
<p>This is your blog and I will respect your decision that I leave and not return.  But, sir, you are very mistaken about Mother Theresa (spelled several ways due to the area one is coming from).  I know FIRST HAND of the works of Mother.  You depend upon what you read in the secular paper rather going to India yourself and witness FIRST HAND.  If you went during her time, you would have been awe struck.  This is not something I read about&#8230;THIS IS WHAT I HAD THE PRIVILEGE TO WITNESS!  My eyes were not deceived and the witness testimony of many who she had comforted, are you telling me that they lied to me?</p>
<p>Again, before I leave, I want to thank all who I had an open and honest dialog with.</p>
<p>Peace and good bye!</p>
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		<title>By: Barry Duke</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14289</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Duke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 21:58:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14289</guid>
		<description>Julie, so far I have been patient with the all the tosh you&#039;ve been spouting on this blog over the last few days, but your latest ignorant blathering about Mother Teresa â€“ get her name right, if you insist on using it â€“ was the last straw. Teresa was a horrible hypocrite and a shameless old fraud who did nothing â€“ I repeat NOTHING â€“ but harm to the people of India. 

Teresa&#039;s hospitals for the indigent in India and elsewhere turned out to be hardly more than human warehouses in which seriously ill persons lay on mats, sometimes fifty to sixty in a room without benefit of adequate medical attention. Their ailments usually went undiagnosed. The food was nutritionally lacking and sanitary conditions were deplorable. There were few medical personnel on the premises, mostly untrained nuns and brothers.

But when tending to her own ailmentsTeresa checked into some of the costliest hospitals and recovery care units in the world for state-of-the-art treatment.

Not once did the Albanian Prune utter a critical word against social injustice, and she maintained cozy relations with the rich, corrupt, and powerful.

She claimed to be above politics when in fact she was pronouncedly hostile toward any kind of progressive reform. Teresa was a friend of Ronald Reagan, and an admiring guest of the Haitian dictator Baby Doc Duvalier. She also had the support and admiration of a number of Central and South American dictators. This is a woman who railed against birth control and abortion, and once said that it was better for an unwanted child to be born and thrown into a garbage can, rather than be aborted.

You can read some more uncomfortable truths about you heroine here: http://mostlywater.org/mother_teresa_faithless_fraud_and_hypocrite 

Go educate yourself, Julie, and until you do so, don&#039;t bother coming back here. You are showing signs of becoming a troll, and we don&#039;t tolerate trolls here. Bye...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julie, so far I have been patient with the all the tosh you&#8217;ve been spouting on this blog over the last few days, but your latest ignorant blathering about Mother Teresa â€“ get her name right, if you insist on using it â€“ was the last straw. Teresa was a horrible hypocrite and a shameless old fraud who did nothing â€“ I repeat NOTHING â€“ but harm to the people of India. </p>
<p>Teresa&#8217;s hospitals for the indigent in India and elsewhere turned out to be hardly more than human warehouses in which seriously ill persons lay on mats, sometimes fifty to sixty in a room without benefit of adequate medical attention. Their ailments usually went undiagnosed. The food was nutritionally lacking and sanitary conditions were deplorable. There were few medical personnel on the premises, mostly untrained nuns and brothers.</p>
<p>But when tending to her own ailmentsTeresa checked into some of the costliest hospitals and recovery care units in the world for state-of-the-art treatment.</p>
<p>Not once did the Albanian Prune utter a critical word against social injustice, and she maintained cozy relations with the rich, corrupt, and powerful.</p>
<p>She claimed to be above politics when in fact she was pronouncedly hostile toward any kind of progressive reform. Teresa was a friend of Ronald Reagan, and an admiring guest of the Haitian dictator Baby Doc Duvalier. She also had the support and admiration of a number of Central and South American dictators. This is a woman who railed against birth control and abortion, and once said that it was better for an unwanted child to be born and thrown into a garbage can, rather than be aborted.</p>
<p>You can read some more uncomfortable truths about you heroine here: <a href="http://mostlywater.org/mother_teresa_faithless_fraud_and_hypocrite" rel="nofollow">http://mostlywater.org/mother_....._hypocrite</a> </p>
<p>Go educate yourself, Julie, and until you do so, don&#8217;t bother coming back here. You are showing signs of becoming a troll, and we don&#8217;t tolerate trolls here. Bye&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Axe</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14283</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Axe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:49:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14283</guid>
		<description>Dear Stonyground and Broga,

My apologies, I did not see your response until just now. You both appear to be very decent and intelligent people and I thank you sincerely for allowing my chatter.  If I was born in the rain forrest?? Well, I believe that God touches absolutely everyone in His own way.  I can not explain how or when because I am a simply person.  To me, the world screams of His existance.  In the sky, the mountains and nature itself.  I am by no means a theologian, scholar or even in their league of knowledge.  I am a simple person who loves the Lord with her whole heart, soul and strength.  This may sound foolish to you and I understand that completely.  As a note, Mother Theresa only spoke of love in her life which demonstrated through her work with the poorest of the poor.  It was not about &quot;her&quot;, it was about love.  That is what I was talking about earlier.  You will know these people through and by their actions...not what they just tell you.  Lily, from what I have read from you, may be a sincere person (I do not know her heart), but she is never going to convey her beliefs through such angry words and malice gestures.  I am sorry for that!  Peace!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Stonyground and Broga,</p>
<p>My apologies, I did not see your response until just now. You both appear to be very decent and intelligent people and I thank you sincerely for allowing my chatter.  If I was born in the rain forrest?? Well, I believe that God touches absolutely everyone in His own way.  I can not explain how or when because I am a simply person.  To me, the world screams of His existance.  In the sky, the mountains and nature itself.  I am by no means a theologian, scholar or even in their league of knowledge.  I am a simple person who loves the Lord with her whole heart, soul and strength.  This may sound foolish to you and I understand that completely.  As a note, Mother Theresa only spoke of love in her life which demonstrated through her work with the poorest of the poor.  It was not about &#8220;her&#8221;, it was about love.  That is what I was talking about earlier.  You will know these people through and by their actions&#8230;not what they just tell you.  Lily, from what I have read from you, may be a sincere person (I do not know her heart), but she is never going to convey her beliefs through such angry words and malice gestures.  I am sorry for that!  Peace!!</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Axe</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14282</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Axe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:26:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14282</guid>
		<description>Remigius,

Thank you as well for your kind words.  Decency (or lack of) comes from a choice that we have all been given.  Yes, I believe all free will and choice come from God.  You know, I have always wondered what type of person I would have been if my dad did not die when I was 7 years old, if I had an opportunity to have a relationship with my grandparents (my mother was an orphan at the age of 2) who had immigrated from Italy not knowing the language. Tragically there has been much sickness and death in the family.  Had it not been for my faith in God, I would probably ended up a basket case.  Again, I am only speaking of myself here.  I can not explain faith as it is impossible to explain to anyone if they have not experienced the gift.  Yes, it is a gift given freely from God.  You ask if there is a &quot;perfect Christian&quot; and the answer is absolutely not.  We all try to live by the 10 commandments; however, we all fall short, but the Lord is always there to forgive....forgive anything!  Can there be a &quot;perfect&quot; Hindu, Muslin, Buddist,atheist, in my opinion.  &quot;no&quot;, because they are only human as we all are.  You would need to ask them yourself for their opinion. I do have one suggestion (with all due respect) for you when dealing with Christians.  Do not engage in any battles with them or allow them to harrass you.  If they do not speak of love and forgiveness, they are self-righteous, self-loving individuals that should be dismissed; however, in a loving way.  Peace to you always!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remigius,</p>
<p>Thank you as well for your kind words.  Decency (or lack of) comes from a choice that we have all been given.  Yes, I believe all free will and choice come from God.  You know, I have always wondered what type of person I would have been if my dad did not die when I was 7 years old, if I had an opportunity to have a relationship with my grandparents (my mother was an orphan at the age of 2) who had immigrated from Italy not knowing the language. Tragically there has been much sickness and death in the family.  Had it not been for my faith in God, I would probably ended up a basket case.  Again, I am only speaking of myself here.  I can not explain faith as it is impossible to explain to anyone if they have not experienced the gift.  Yes, it is a gift given freely from God.  You ask if there is a &#8220;perfect Christian&#8221; and the answer is absolutely not.  We all try to live by the 10 commandments; however, we all fall short, but the Lord is always there to forgive&#8230;.forgive anything!  Can there be a &#8220;perfect&#8221; Hindu, Muslin, Buddist,atheist, in my opinion.  &#8220;no&#8221;, because they are only human as we all are.  You would need to ask them yourself for their opinion. I do have one suggestion (with all due respect) for you when dealing with Christians.  Do not engage in any battles with them or allow them to harrass you.  If they do not speak of love and forgiveness, they are self-righteous, self-loving individuals that should be dismissed; however, in a loving way.  Peace to you always!</p>
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		<title>By: Broga</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14277</link>
		<dc:creator>Broga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:48:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14277</guid>
		<description>Julie.  I have a wife, children etc but none of them are &quot;perfect.&quot;  And I don&#039;t want them to be any more than they want that from me.  In fact, the grit in the oyster adds spice.

Remigius&#039; questions/comments are worth an answer and not a dismissal.  To add just briefly:  what do you think your religion or belief system would be if you had been born in the midst of the Amazonian Rain Forest, or the Congo or whatever, and never heard of Christianity, never mind Jesus?

Lily is a rather simple minded nuisance who plagues atheist or sceptical web sites in what seems to be a ludicrous attempt to convert non believers by virtue of the fact that she and the Pope know best.  She has a dog, or had, unless it perished under the weight of her sanctimony.    She is convinced that I am headed for an infinity of hell fire and will not accept that whatever my sins i.e. slagging off Mother Theresa and the Pope they cannot justify an infinity of extreme torture.   

There is a rumour, but I really cannot confirm this and would not want to besmirch her reputation to this extent, that she is a fan of Cliff Richard and attends his concerts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julie.  I have a wife, children etc but none of them are &#8220;perfect.&#8221;  And I don&#8217;t want them to be any more than they want that from me.  In fact, the grit in the oyster adds spice.</p>
<p>Remigius&#8217; questions/comments are worth an answer and not a dismissal.  To add just briefly:  what do you think your religion or belief system would be if you had been born in the midst of the Amazonian Rain Forest, or the Congo or whatever, and never heard of Christianity, never mind Jesus?</p>
<p>Lily is a rather simple minded nuisance who plagues atheist or sceptical web sites in what seems to be a ludicrous attempt to convert non believers by virtue of the fact that she and the Pope know best.  She has a dog, or had, unless it perished under the weight of her sanctimony.    She is convinced that I am headed for an infinity of hell fire and will not accept that whatever my sins i.e. slagging off Mother Theresa and the Pope they cannot justify an infinity of extreme torture.   </p>
<p>There is a rumour, but I really cannot confirm this and would not want to besmirch her reputation to this extent, that she is a fan of Cliff Richard and attends his concerts.</p>
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		<title>By: Stonyground</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14275</link>
		<dc:creator>Stonyground</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:38:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14275</guid>
		<description>I thought that I should come back on and apologise to Julie as I feel that my last post was unnesessarily hostile and somewhat uncalled for.
But then in her response to me she failed to address the points that I made about Deism And Pascal&#039;s wager. Constantly learning new stuff is one of my favourite aspects of life. If someone draws my attention to something that I don&#039;t know about I am always eager to investigate, and now that knowledge is just a mouse click away not even feeling a bit lazy is an excuse. I think it is a little sad that believers like to visit us to preach at us but seem to have no desire to learn from us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought that I should come back on and apologise to Julie as I feel that my last post was unnesessarily hostile and somewhat uncalled for.<br />
But then in her response to me she failed to address the points that I made about Deism And Pascal&#8217;s wager. Constantly learning new stuff is one of my favourite aspects of life. If someone draws my attention to something that I don&#8217;t know about I am always eager to investigate, and now that knowledge is just a mouse click away not even feeling a bit lazy is an excuse. I think it is a little sad that believers like to visit us to preach at us but seem to have no desire to learn from us.</p>
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		<title>By: remigius</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14270</link>
		<dc:creator>remigius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:20:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14270</guid>
		<description>Julie Axe. I do not doubt that you are a genuinely decent person. But I would question where you think that decency comes from. Does it really come from a god, or are you inherently a good person anyway?

If you had been born 4 millennia ago, before Christianity or the concept of a monotheistic deity had been created, would you still have the same outlook/attitude? I realise this is hypothetical but so is the existence of a deity in the eyes of many of us on this site.

You also raise the issue of &#039;a perfect Christian&#039;. What is this? Can there be a perfect Hindu, a perfect Muslim, a perfect Buddhist?

Can there even be a perfect atheist?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julie Axe. I do not doubt that you are a genuinely decent person. But I would question where you think that decency comes from. Does it really come from a god, or are you inherently a good person anyway?</p>
<p>If you had been born 4 millennia ago, before Christianity or the concept of a monotheistic deity had been created, would you still have the same outlook/attitude? I realise this is hypothetical but so is the existence of a deity in the eyes of many of us on this site.</p>
<p>You also raise the issue of &#8216;a perfect Christian&#8217;. What is this? Can there be a perfect Hindu, a perfect Muslim, a perfect Buddhist?</p>
<p>Can there even be a perfect atheist?</p>
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		<title>By: Julie Axe</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14265</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie Axe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 17:11:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14265</guid>
		<description>Broga,

I thank you for your kind words.  I understand completely what you are saying about some religious people; however, remember they are not the people you should be listening to anyway.  They are only looking for their own glory rather than the glory due to the Lord.  Broga, please believe me when I say that I have total peace in my life.  This does not mean that I do not have the same troubles as other people, it just means that I handle it differently.  I am saying this to you in all humility.  I have a wonderful husband, wonderful children and the best grandchildren in the world....spoken like any other grandmother, or what we call in Italian, Nonie!  Broga, please try not to judge all Christians by some of the self-seeking people you may have met or spoken to in your life.  True Christians follow the teachings of Jesus Christ with love and respect for all individuals no matter what their belief system may be.  We are all brothers and sisters.  Just think if everyone lived by that love and respect, there would be no wars, homelessness and heartache in the world.  Yes, maybe there would be heartache, but we would all work together for the common good of humanity.  There is so much greed and arrogance in this world, it is sickening.  I am by NO means a perfect Christian because I fall as many others do, but I ask for forgiveness and is forgiven.  By the way, I have no idea who you are talking about.....who is Lily?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Broga,</p>
<p>I thank you for your kind words.  I understand completely what you are saying about some religious people; however, remember they are not the people you should be listening to anyway.  They are only looking for their own glory rather than the glory due to the Lord.  Broga, please believe me when I say that I have total peace in my life.  This does not mean that I do not have the same troubles as other people, it just means that I handle it differently.  I am saying this to you in all humility.  I have a wonderful husband, wonderful children and the best grandchildren in the world&#8230;.spoken like any other grandmother, or what we call in Italian, Nonie!  Broga, please try not to judge all Christians by some of the self-seeking people you may have met or spoken to in your life.  True Christians follow the teachings of Jesus Christ with love and respect for all individuals no matter what their belief system may be.  We are all brothers and sisters.  Just think if everyone lived by that love and respect, there would be no wars, homelessness and heartache in the world.  Yes, maybe there would be heartache, but we would all work together for the common good of humanity.  There is so much greed and arrogance in this world, it is sickening.  I am by NO means a perfect Christian because I fall as many others do, but I ask for forgiveness and is forgiven.  By the way, I have no idea who you are talking about&#8230;..who is Lily?</p>
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		<title>By: Broga</title>
		<link>http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/03/16/another-whingeing-catholic-demands-more-respect-for-christianity/comment-page-1/#comment-14261</link>
		<dc:creator>Broga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 16:30:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freethinker.co.uk/?p=5155#comment-14261</guid>
		<description>Julie.   You do seem to be of a more gentle disposition then many of your co religionists.   I doubt if you will, or could, consider the implications of you  &quot;looking forward&quot; to &quot;complete happiness.&quot;   The old &quot;treasure in heaven&quot; con.    I suppose that means that you are sacrificing a happy present for a euphoric future of very doubtful provenance - to say the least.   I, as it happens, am happy enough at the moment.   I don&#039;t &quot;seek god&quot; and I don&#039;t &quot;seek happiness&quot; but I do enjoy getting whatever pleasure and fun I can from the here and now. 

Suppose you are seeking the &quot;wrong&quot; god?   There are so many.   And suppose you have put your life in the hands of that god and another god is offended and decides to punish you?    

Or perhaps the bible is a test?   The &quot;real&quot; god has decided that those who abuse his greatest gift - as he might see it - being rational by succumbing to arrant nonsence spewed out by priests and the like have failed.   They end up in hell.   The atheists - bit self serving for me is this Julie - have the courage to say &quot;this is crap&quot; and they go to heaven?

What really pisses me off is the smug, self satisfaction of some of the most mean minded, tight arsed people I have ever come across and they are Christians.   They go with the crowd, safety in numbers, try to censor what they don&#039;t like and whine when they don&#039;t get respect.  And they never think for themselves.

I have no wish for you to leave.  And it isn&#039;t my decision anyway.  You do seem dangerously innocent and you might, I suppose, even start thinking about some of these matters.   Your co religionist, Lily, is beyond hope.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julie.   You do seem to be of a more gentle disposition then many of your co religionists.   I doubt if you will, or could, consider the implications of you  &#8220;looking forward&#8221; to &#8220;complete happiness.&#8221;   The old &#8220;treasure in heaven&#8221; con.    I suppose that means that you are sacrificing a happy present for a euphoric future of very doubtful provenance &#8211; to say the least.   I, as it happens, am happy enough at the moment.   I don&#8217;t &#8220;seek god&#8221; and I don&#8217;t &#8220;seek happiness&#8221; but I do enjoy getting whatever pleasure and fun I can from the here and now. </p>
<p>Suppose you are seeking the &#8220;wrong&#8221; god?   There are so many.   And suppose you have put your life in the hands of that god and another god is offended and decides to punish you?    </p>
<p>Or perhaps the bible is a test?   The &#8220;real&#8221; god has decided that those who abuse his greatest gift &#8211; as he might see it &#8211; being rational by succumbing to arrant nonsence spewed out by priests and the like have failed.   They end up in hell.   The atheists &#8211; bit self serving for me is this Julie &#8211; have the courage to say &#8220;this is crap&#8221; and they go to heaven?</p>
<p>What really pisses me off is the smug, self satisfaction of some of the most mean minded, tight arsed people I have ever come across and they are Christians.   They go with the crowd, safety in numbers, try to censor what they don&#8217;t like and whine when they don&#8217;t get respect.  And they never think for themselves.</p>
<p>I have no wish for you to leave.  And it isn&#8217;t my decision anyway.  You do seem dangerously innocent and you might, I suppose, even start thinking about some of these matters.   Your co religionist, Lily, is beyond hope.</p>
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