ANYTHING that even vaguely pleases right-wing Christians has to be regarded with deep suspicion – and we are extremely concerned to learn at the weekend that a report issued by the American Psychological Association has received a cautious welcome from Bob Stith, a fundamentalist Texan pastor and a key player in the deeply-discredited “ex-gay” movement.
This despicable, posturing nincompoop, who has the grand title of “Southern Baptist national strategist for gender issues” and “the representative of the denomination’s Task Force on Ministry to Homosexuals”, said:
The report was much better than I had expected.
It appears from this report that the APA has partially validated the efforts of the “ex-gay” movement to fuck muck up people’s lives by saying that:
Religious individuals who desire to leave homosexuality should be assisted in doing so.
True, the 130-page APA task force paper does conclude there is little evidence that “gay-to-straight” therapies work. It also affirms APA’s position that homosexual attractions are “normal and positive variants” of human sexuality, but conservatives are taking heart from this outrageous observation in the report’s conclusion:
[W]e take the perspective that religious faith and psychology do not have to be seen as being opposed to each other.
Alan Chambers, “ex-gay” President of one the largest “ex-gay” ministries – Exodus International – welcomed the report:
Optimistically, I think that this is gradual change [at APA], and we believe that gradual change is better than no change at all. So, for the APA to come out with some nod toward religious folks who are conflicted about these issues, it’s a good sign. What’s not good is that they deny the truth of my story and the truth of the story of tens of thousands of other people like me that have experienced not only significant but real and lasting change.
"Ex-gay" Alan Chambers
He added:
The APA has said that their psychologists and counsellors need to respect a client’s religious beliefs . That’s the first time they’ve ever acknowledged anything of that nature.
Part of the divide between the APA and the Christian community, Chambers said, could be attributed to what is and is not considered change. For instance, the report criticised recent studies that conservatives have touted as supporting their position. APA brushed off those conclusions by noting the study’s subjects “became skilled in ignoring or tolerating their same-sex attractions’. The APA considers such a person a homosexual.
But Chambers and others like him believe that, biblically speaking, the APA is simply describing former homosexuals who are resisting temptation. In other words, those former homosexuals – according to Christian theology – are winning their battle with sin.
Warren Throckmorton, associate professor of psychology at Grove City College, a Christian school in Ohio, disagrees with parts of the paper, but, overall, was pleased with it.
In fact, he said some of the paper’s conclusions are what conservatives have been urging the APA to conclude for two-plus years. He said conservatives have long urged the APA to respect “religious clients’ right to define themselves the way they want to.” Such patients, he said, come in all forms.
Chambers said the debate over whether homosexuals can change is at the heart of Christian theology and practice.
If this isn’t possible, then nothing else with regards to addition or life-dominating issues is possible.
As a homosexual who for years lived a complete lie, and ended up having a nervous breakdown, due to brainwashing by religious fundamentalists, I was horrified when I read the other day of these conclusions by the APA. We must give these fascists no quarter whatsoever, as they are destroying people's lives, and driving a great number to suicide, as you have stated here only recently, Barry. (I even considered it myself at one stage.) Creeps like Stith and Chambers make my blood boil. Homosexual Christians are not "resisting temptation", they are denying their true identity! They are not "winning their battle with sin", they are losing their fight to be who they really are. But of course, as Chambers says (and I do paraphrase a little here): "If you can't give up this vile and Godless lifestyle, then you are without hope and headed for a lost eternity!"
one look at chambers – good grief! – I'm sure I've seen a novelty dildo that looks just like him!
Not cheeky at all, I mean look at Chambers' suit! My Gay-dar went haywire.
This comment is a bit cheeky, but I wonder how many readers, if "ex-homosexual" Alan Chambers were placed in a line-up, would still pick him out as The Gay One!! hahaha!!!
Looking at these pictures and reading the story, I'm glad I don't have to worry about 'god' and my personal sexuality. If only it could be like that for everybody.
"Religious individuals who desire to leave homosexuality should be assisted in doing so." When will these brain dead morons learn that you cannot "leave" homosexuality; every reasonable person knows that you are born either gay, straight or if lucky, bat for both sides. You cannot be ex-gay, only repressed [or should that be oppressed] with the serious damage that does to the individual. Anyone who says they are ex-gay was either not gay to start with, a liar or brainwashed with guilt and religious bollocks. What we need is a cure for the mental illness that is religious belief. And another thing: psychology is not a proper medical discipline.
Psychology not a proper discipline…. Not a scientologist are ya? ;o)
Just kidding – they do have it the wrong way round- they should be curing gay (and straight) people of their religion instead!
Read this if you've got a strong enough stomach for it!
http://www.bridges-across.org/ba/stith_keep_conte…
Apparently, cuddly, kind old "Pastor Bob" is being victimised! (Haven't I heard that complaint somewhere else recently?) He isn't coming down hard on those Sodomizers at all, in actual fact. This is all misrepresentation and hyperbole. He is being unfairly "labelled". (Yes – he really does say that!!) In fact, some people are even accusing him of belonging to the "religious right" – where on earth would they get THAT idea from? All he is attempting to do is to engage in "compassionate outreach" to the "homosexual community". (Remember Cool Hand Luke?: "Wish you'd stop bein' so good to me!"). God even "broke his heart" over the matter, so I suppose he feels that he needs to pass on the favour. (Don't these religious types talk a load of bollocks?) There's a lot more of this in his article, which you ought to read for yourselves, as I would really hate to be one of those he accuses of "misrepresenting" him!
Does the American Tealeaf Readers Association really want to prove that it has more therapeutic value than such other practitioners of sympathetic listening as bartenders, taxi drivers and hetaeras? Then it should approach its gay patients' conflict between their innate homosexuality and their religious brainwashing by making them realize that the real source of their anguish is their addiction to the mind-crippling perversion of godworship that pretends that victimless behavior can constitute disobedience to an imaginary dice-tossing Sky Fuhrer.
Wonder how many Christian psychologists it would take to change a lightbulb?
What you are looking at is a common type of fundie. They have a fixed grin, trimmed hair (is that thatch of his real), superfial shine from the most horrible clothes which they think are smart and the entire stiff, rigid, unbending (stop it, please!) posture covers a repressed sexuality, blocked sense of fun and utter absence of spontaneity. The result is a warped personailty, allied to a deep dishonesty, which often ends with them being exposed as shaggers of their secretaries, secret supporters of abortion and they help themselves to loads of cash to support a luxurious lifestyle. This is one sick indivudal.
None. They prefer to be kept in the dark!
I would guess none, Stuart. They would call in an electrician to change the whole light fitting!
Exodus International has been dogged by scandals that would be funny if not for the damage that has doubtless been caused by these peddlers of verbal snake oil along the way. For one thing, two of the ministry's male co-founders ended up as a (rich) couple.
Liked Pastor Stith's rant in the link above about how EI's most famous client John Paulk has been viciously wronged. What does he expect people to think about a man who turns himself into an ex-gay celebrity only to get caught chatting up a guy in a gay bar and admit to still having feelings for men after trying to lie his way out of it? 'Poor lamb; at least he's trying'?
Reading some of Alan Chambers' blog moments ago, I half expected to be swatting bees from the screen it is so honey glazed.
Y'know, Ed, looking at Chambers' picture again, I am reminded of those cheesy models who modelled frightful cardigans in the knitting pattern books of the 50s and 60s my mum used to collect. She only ever knitted me one – and was ever so miffed when I flatly refused to wear it. This is the sort of thing I mean:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/infidel69/3807704903…
So Scientology is right in recognizing psychology as pseudoscience. They are also right when they predict that the sun will rise tomorrow. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
As anyone who has watched such legal fiction as Law and Order must surely have noticed, every time a defendant's psychiatrist testifies that the defendant is not morally culpable, the prosecution produces a psychiatrist who testifies the precise opposite.
In all legitimate scientific disciplines, there are general principles or theories that have near-unanimous support. In contrast, psychology has schools (Skinnerian, Freudian, Gestalt, etc, etc) so incompatible that for any one school to be legitimate, all others must be incompetent hogwash — the same as in religion. Indeed, Thomas Szasz has concluded that psychiatry IS a religion. It is certainly not science. There may well be a "knowledge of the mind" some day, and research in the area is justifiable. But as of now, a science of psychology does not exist.
In 2003 the BBC magazine published a piece entitled "When Gays were Cured". One of those who suffered atrocious treatment at the hands of a psychiatrist was British DJ and stand-up comic Peter Price, then 18. Price was not cured, but soon after, to his horror, discovered that the man who subjected him to aversion therapy, left him lying in his own excrement, and applied electrodes to his penis, was HIMSELF gay. "I was furious. I tried to attack him with a broken bottle," Price says.
You can read the whole harrowing account here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3258041.stm
It would indeed be none, as they would sit you down and convince you that you didn't need the light!
Never watched any legal drama actually – the real thing is enough of a stupid pantomime for me.
Besides I'm scouse – we don't do "psychiatry" or see "analysts" or go to "therapy" here – we simply "get a grip", "man-up", or "f*kin behave will ya lad", as the situation requires.
)
As a teacher I'm well versed in Skinner's behaviourst works, kolb's theories and Pavlovian response and can see some merit thereabouts… However I agree of course that psychiatry isn't a real scientific discipline – I was merely japing earlier re the scientology line – I recently read Battlefield Earth for some reason or other – best bit – the baddies were called "psychlos" and the worst ones "catrists!" Put em together and LULZ are had by all.
PS – CG Jung said Liverpool is the pool of life – so I like him over freud
)
Some of the more bizarre knitting patterns are now appearing, complete with captions, on greetings cards. One that I saw was a man dressed in a cardigan with integral balaclava, a sort of knitted hoodie. I don't recall what the caption was but the picture itself was hilarious.
By the way, Ron Hubbard was particularly prescient when he foresaw that the most effective way to fleece the most gullible one percent of the population with a science fiction scam would be to pass it off as a religion.
bloody hell – that's awful – I never knew Pete Price was meant to be funny! (He is on Radio Merseyside everyday after all!)
Seriously though – there's so much sick shit done in the name of religion – HOW is it not outlawed for it's horrific dehumanisation and inhume barbarism!
uhhh…Angela_K pointed it out: "Religious individuals who desire to leave homosexuality should be assisted in doing so."
The inconsistency is the usage of the term 'leave' homosexuality.
It negates the APA's whole previously defined admission of what being gay means.
umm…Duh?
If you can 'leave' being gay…umm…is anyone else here smelling the foul odor of 'placating the xtian reich for fear of retribution' or have I been too involved in conspiracy theories?
You got me on a roll, now, Stonyground. Check out
<a href="http://www.swankylobster.com/Swanky.html” target=”_blank”>http://www.swankylobster.com/Swanky.html
oh, and this:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/drew-o-rama/25554486…
Ah, yes – Cable Stitch! My mother ALWAYS used that on jumpers and cardigans!! (Probably what turned me gay, come to think of it!!!)
He's supposed to have said that, and I keep reading the "quote", but was it an apocryphal story? it certainly proved true in his life, however!
He's supposed to have said that, and I keep reading the "quote", but was it an apocryphal story? It certainly proved true in his life, however!
Everyone should have a look at this;
http://www.exodus-international.org/
In particular, go to "Who We Are" and then to "Policy Statements". It really is the most appalling, stomach-churning, mindless nonsense you will ever read.
Jeez, Barrie, did you have to post that link just before I before I was about to sit down to dinner? These people are FUCKING INSANE!
You can tell, just by looking at the picture of Alan Chambers, that he is still 100% gay, whether or not he admits it. My gaydar is never wrong. I’m so sick of these dumbass Christians outright lying about being able to alter your sexuality. Mr. Chambers needs to stop putting other gays in the same situation he was too weak to stand up against. He is a coward and a bigot towards his own people. What a douche.
come on guys. someone needs to produce a 'Jesus dildo' – so that people can feel the love of Christ inside them….
If god dislikes gay folk so much, why did he create so many of them?
I am so behind the curve on this one
http://www.divine-interventions.com/
LOL!!! that's the funniest remark ever! even funnier than the patterns and that's saying something…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCzbNkyXO50
Their problem is that they'll look for any crumb they can dredge up and twist to their advantage. If they find one sentence in a 100+ page report that doesn't denounce what they're doing they'll hawk it to the extreme and ignore everything else, thereby making it look as if the entire report was supporting their BS. They are vile, lying, predatory scum without ethics or compassion.
For some reason, Jon Atack does not quote that particular line in A Piece of Blue Sky. But I have seen it in several sources I deem reliable. (See the article on Hubbard in Wikipedia.) Atack did write that Hubbard told a coconspirator, "Let's sell these people a piece of blue sky" (p. iii).
I know – it looks for all the world like a "spoof" site, like Landover Baptists, to anyone with a modicum of intelligence or sophistication. There is even a Sister Talitha lookalike on the home page, grinning at you like some mindless imbecile! As far as I can see, the sole raison d'etre for this organization is to make fundamentalist Christians feel better about themselves for hating gays. It's certainly not in existence to help gay people! See what they say in their Church and Counselling section: "We believe that God wants to heal homosexuals through His Church." Have you ever read a more stupid statement in your entire life? They must know that it's bunkum!!
At least you weren't forced to wear a mauve and green tank-top that your Auntie Daphne had knocked up during one of her brief bouts of lucidity.
Thanks for bringing up that deeply repressed memory, you bastards!
But my mother still has a family photo of me at my aunt's wearing a little woolly jumper she had knitted, with three lovely yachts on it! (At least I was only about four at the time) However, she also has another photo of me, at the beach, wearing a pair of (you guessed it) KNITTED SWIMMING TRUNKS!! They're almost round my knees – hahahahaha!!!
Whatever you want – it's on the net! God's Immaculate Rod indeed!!
The words seem to vary in different quotes, but then he could have said a similar thing on different occasions, as people often do, so I'm inclined to believe it too.
I am reminded of Catherine Tate's character, Derek Faye, here! For the benefit of our American cousins, this comedy creation is a limp-wristed, obviously gay, extremely camp guy with a handbag, who is ALWAYS outraged at the mere suggestion that he might possibly be batting for the other side ("How very dare you!"). He flounces out of every confrontation with the words, "Who dear? Me dear? Gay dear? No dear!" Chambers is almost his double!!
I'm a bit slow, aren't I? This is the internet, after all! Go to:
http://www.catherinetateshow.co.uk/characters/der…
There are videos of "him" on YouTube as well!!
Yep! Those Christian rats are the very worst type all right!!
BTW For the added benefit of American readers of this blog, the name Derek would also be considered quite amusing on this side of the Atlantic. It is one of those names that went out of fashion about 50 years ago, along with Melvin and Dennis, and, rightly or wrongly, was considered to be the type of name chosen for her beloved offspring by a certain kind of rather snooty, doting, molly-coddling mother!
Look at those eyes–a wacko nutjob who is so high and deluded by Jesus he wouldn't be capable of doing anything himself, unless it were killing for his god.