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Laws on freedom and tolerance pose a threat to religion, warns Catholic cardinal

GOVERNMENTS must be wary of the impact that laws enshrining “freedom and tolerance” might have on the religious bodies.

The warning that some people were trying to “privatise” religion and drive it out of public life was sounded by Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O’Connor, the former Archbishop of Westminster and leader of the Roman Catholic Church in England and Wales.

Cardinal Cormac Murphy O'Connor. Photograph: Kirsty Wigglesworth/AP

Cardinal Cormac Murphy O’Connor. Photograph: Kirsty Wigglesworth/AP

But he just stopped short of playing the “persecution” card, saying:

I don’t think Christians are persecuted in Britain. But I think there are some sections who would like to privatise religion and put it on the periphery.

The Church has a part to play within public life and increasingly should play it, speaking about church affairs and affairs of the nation – making a contribution not from a position of power, but an interest and concern in light of what they believe.

He added to this meaningless guff that while the majority of Britons were happy for churches to have a role in public debate – really?

 There are some who would say they don’t need the church’s voice at all. I don’t agree. I think that governments have to be very careful how they legislate, so that freedom and tolerance does not become intolerance for some sections.

He spoke in the wake of a row over legislation that forced Catholic adoption agencies to close because they would have had to offer their services to same-sex couples, in breach of the Church’s teachings.

Cardinal Murphy-O’Connor added there were 139 countries where Christians were persecuted to a greater or lesser extent.

Not enough is done in the West to speak out against this. In  certain areas there is a lot of discrimination and I don’t think its getting better.

I would remind readers that this pillock of society was the subject of a naughty, atheistic  BBC investigation that showed that Murphy O’Connor had failed to act appropriately when dealing with paedophile priests on his turf.

Meanwhile, another Catholic who failed to act appropriately in regard to the GLOBAL child abuse scandal, shadow Pope Joseph Ratzinger, is back in the news, this time in a report about The Ratzinger Prize. This  “prestigious” award has just gone  to two professors for their “exemplary scholarship in theology”.

This is what Robert A Heinlein said of the subject:

Theology is never any help; it is searching in a dark cellar at midnight for a black cat that isn’t there. Theologians can persuade themselves of anything.

The 2013 winners were the Anglican Rev Canon Professor Richard Burridge, dean of Kings College, London – the first non-Catholic to take the prize – and Catholic professor of theology Christian Schaller, vice director of the Pope Benedict XVI institute of Regensburg, Germany.

In dishing out the the prizes, the real Pope – Frankie – said:

No one can measure how much good has been done through the works of Joseph Ratzinger.

 

42 Responses to “Laws on freedom and tolerance pose a threat to religion, warns Catholic cardinal”

  1. Mike De Fleuriot says:

    Now taking bets for when he will be discovered down on his weary and well-worn old knees in some dreary motel or latrine, with an expired Visa card, having tried to pay well over the odds to be peed upon by some Apache transvestite; to misquote Hitchens.

  2. Canada Dave says:

    “No one can measure how much good has been done through the works of Joseph Ratzinger.”

    That is not quite true….atomic particles are very hard to see with the unaided eye….but you can catch a glimpse with an electron microscope…..Ratzingers work is like that ….one has to be told that his good works actually exist… as they are not very obvious to the naked eye.

  3. The Woggler says:

    Can anybody explain what privatising religion means? I wasn’t aware that religion was state-owned.

  4. barriejohn says:

    “No one can measure how much good has been done through the works of Joseph Ratzinger.”

    Actually, I agree with that statement completely. It’s impossible!

  5. barriejohn says:

    It would appear that Benny (“I can’t believe it’s not the Pope”)is none too popular amongst certain elements of the Catholic Church:

    http://www.zazzle.com/benedict_xvi_is_not_the_pope_shirts-235146221207249315

    Scroll down, though, and there’s another one that says “Is the Pope Catholic?”. Have they had enough of BOTH these two clowns then?

  6. Canada Dave says:

    Cardinal Cormac Murphy O’Connor looks like he or is about to wet himself……or someone has stepped on his tail.

  7. charlie says:

    LOLMAO, I agree, nobody can measure the “good” that has been done by ex-pope (poop) Ratzi. It is very difficult to measure what does not exist. Now, as to the absolute harm the clown has done, well, there isn’t enough time, nor the space here to even begin that list.
    Just my own 2 cents worth.

  8. oldmanjenkins says:

    “Not enough is done in the West to speak out against this. In certain areas there is a lot of discrimination and I don’t think its getting better.” Um yeah O’Connor, but this is one religion discriminating against another religion. You’ve got a magical thought in your head? Keep it there you wanker.

  9. Angela_K says:

    All this odious ring-kissing-Mary-worshipper is worried about is more legislation to stop him and his fellow cultists getting away with their bigotry.

  10. Broga says:

    I wonder how Murph is spending his time now. It must be impossible for anyone with even the fewest of their brain cells still intact not to ponder on what he has done with his life. Dreary, arid decades, denied any intimacy (well overt anyway) and left preaching obvious nonsense and which he must recognise as such.

    I suppose he has nothing left except cling to the charade to which he sacrificed his life.

  11. Ivan says:

    “….there were 139 countries where Christians were persecuted to a greater or lesser extent….”

    He fails to mention this is usually not at the hands of non-believers but at the hands of a different branch of the Abrahamic cult.

  12. Ivan says:

    @Mike De Fleuriot

    “….having tried to pay well over the odds to be peed upon by some Apache transvestite….”

    A Wig Wam Bam, as it were.

  13. Caute says:

    The foolish cardinal looks rather florid …has he been seeking solace with bottles of Jameson’s Tut tut tut.

  14. Caute says:

    Well I say lets make it 140 countries and do unto the pious that which they have done to us throughout history.

  15. Broga says:

    @Caute: The bottle is often the ready solace sought by the lonely. However, it usually causes more problems and misery than it allays.

  16. RussellW says:

    Yes, let’s privatise religion, particularly religious organisations, the faithful would own shares and, for example, the “Roman Catholic Church Pty Ltd” would be as taxable as any other business enterprise and subject to the usual corporate regulation.

  17. Angelo ventura says:

    The only freedom the craptolic church recognizes it’s its own to impose on others. TBigots can go to hell with their “RELIGIOUS FREEDOM”

  18. sailor1031 says:

    Is this the same pompous, irritating, arrogant little dickhead that told us that we atheists were less than human? Ah yes – thought so. Well he can just fuck off back into his own little bigoted private bubble world. We don’t need him or his ilk in this real world.

  19. JohnMWhite says:

    I think that governments have to be very careful how they legislate, so that freedom and tolerance does not become intolerance for some sections.

    Such as making sure that the freedom to practice one’s own religion does not become intolerance for non-adherents living their own lives? The freedom to preach from the pulpit of any faith of one’s choosing without refusing to allow certain people to marry, adopt children or attend your tax-payer funded school?

  20. Robster says:

    There’s only 149 countries on the planet. If the daggy old bish’s claim is correct, that would mean there only 11 countries where Christians are welcome and free to spread their fraudulent nonsense. If he’s speaking the truth we may as well go home, job’s done.

  21. JohnMWhite says:

    There are around 206 countries on Earth, actually, give or take a few based on territory disputes. Still, the idea that well over half the globe is not friendly to Christianity is silly. True, Christians are genuinely (and violently) persecuted in some locales, but the Cardinal’s definition of persecution is to simply not have the state allow Christian dogma to dictate how it treats its people. This is a guy who by implication thinks Russia persecutes people less than Scotland, and it is simply because the kind of people the Russian state openly persecutes are not people as far as he’s concerned. When O’Connor sheds as many tears for the gays jailed in Russia or facing execution in Uganda and Iran, maybe he won’t come off as a bigoted toddler crying because he’s not allowed to hit the other kids any more.

  22. Trevor Blake says:

    In the USA, religious organizations are not taxed. And how do we know they are religious organizations? They say they are! And why aren’t they taxed? Because they provide services and thus relieve the government from providing those services. And what are those services? They are religious services! Exactly the sort of services the government is forbidden from providing. Meanwhile, secular social services must provide quantifiable social goods (so many meals served, so many patients seen, etc.).

    How about the government either require religious bodies to follow the same laws as secular social services or they pay taxes? How about government provided services diminish and religious services rise – as it was for most of human history?

  23. Charles Denel says:

    Atheists face much more discrimination than you do around the world. Why do your Christians get to be picked out for special treatment? If you had two braincells and were a decent human being you would be campaigning for universal tolerance, freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom of thought globally. Then not only would your Christians benefit but other people would too and the world would be a happier place.

    Twat.

  24. Barfly says:

    So laws on tolerance and freedom are a threat to religion. So they need to be intolerant and restrict freedom to keep going. That’s a nice confession. I wonder if the catholic church would be floated on the stock exchange.

  25. ExPatriot says:

    The Romans had the right idea they just didn’t eliminate enough of them.

  26. […] Laws on freedom and tolerance pose a threat to religion, warns Catholic cardinal […]

  27. Thoughtland says:

    Religion killed billions of people for not believing, or being the wrong kind of believer.

    christians are not persecuted in the UK. They are ignored and rightly so. They couldn’t fill a church unless there were TV cameras there or its something to do with the Da Vinci Code.

    christianity is the wish for all life to come to an end so that a few can go to an everlasting party in the sky while the rest of us burn forever in he fiery lava lochs of Hades.

    Religion is the distribution of unauthorised, unqualified judgement, bigotry, hatred, slavery and death.

  28. John C says:

    I would argue that old ratzinger did a great deal of good works,his actions and attitudes inadvertently advanced the cause of atheism no end.

  29. AgentCormac says:

    @ ExPatriot

    Unfortunately the Romans, primarily in the form of Constantine the ‘Great’, were also responsible for doing more than pretty much anyone else in spreading the virus known as christianity far and wide. Constantine’s conversion is apparently referred to as the ‘Triumph of the Church’. Triumph of delusion over reality, more like.

    What did the Romans ever do for us? Fucked us all up right royally, that’s what.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantine_the_Great_and_Christianity

  30. Broga says:

    @AgentCormac: I think Constantine was confronted with a number of belief systems and made the political decision to choose Christianity because the Christians were being the greatest nuisance at the time. And, as you say, he opened a major can of worms when he made that decision.

  31. Stephen Mynett says:

    I agree Broga, Constantine was no different to any other dictator, a ruthless opportunist and he saw Christianity as a useful tool to help him.

  32. MissingHitch says:

    These ‘Bastards’ aren’t worried about the human beings they’re supposed to be ministering to. They’re worried about their ‘FREAKING’ jobs………….! And yes, I do agree, Ratzinger did do a lot of good…. He helped prove what a pathetic, horrible, scam religion is… and, he helped create many, many new Atheists, and he helped empty the pews. Screw you Ratzinger, your NAZI mother- F**ker!!! And,thank you for not darkening the world by your presence any longer!

  33. […] regardless of their opinions. Why should we be treated any differently? In other news, *facepalm* Laws on freedom and tolerance pose a threat to religion, warns Catholic cardinal If that's the case…maybe you should go re-read those bits of the Bible that preach tolerance, […]

  34. Har Davids says:

    There already is a lot of privatized religion with church-members coughing up their tithes or church-taxes, so their shepherds can live in style, one of them being the Roman Catholic Church.

  35. barriejohn says:

    Har Davids: I agree entirely, and the whole question of “charities” also needs looking at closely, as the vast majority are “faith” run scams.

  36. gedediah says:

    I don’t think the good Cardinal appreciates the full implications of his warning. If public opinion is at odds with his religion’s dogma then it’s the dogma that has to give, otherwise his religion will go down the toilet like so may before it.

  37. Michael Bater says:

    Typical Catholic Church, trying to enforce their outdated views on others.

  38. S.U. says:

    “He spoke in the wake of a row over legislation that forced Catholic adoption agencies to close because they would have had to offer their services to same-sex couples, in breach of the Church’s teachings.”

    I wish people would get their facts right about this incident: Leeds Catholic Care (LCC) (and its like) is a faith-based organisation that like many faith based organisations in the UK (and many Western nations – including the USA) is heavily reliant on the taxpayer for its funding. In addition to happily employing anyone regardless of belief (you usually find believers on the board of trustees and in senior management – alas too few of our Christian friends want to work for minimum or near minimum wage on the front line getting their hands dirty, so they employ anyone willing to do it – despite the fact the law happily allows faith-based organisations to employ on believers if they so wish – many don’t because they know they’d be unable to fill the posts with just Christians).

    At the time LCC first argued against allowing same-sex couples to adopt, its donation income was around 4% (it’s now 5% – see: http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Showcharity/RegisterOfCharities/CharityWithPartB.aspx?RegisteredCharityNumber=513063&SubsidiaryNumber=0) and made around five adoptions a year – hardly big business! Much of LCC’s work was rather home care and day centres and the like – funded by contracting with the local authority and the odd government grant.

    To this day, there is nothing preventing the Catholics of Leeds (or anywhere else) setting up their own adoption agency as a private company and paying for the work themselves. Hence legislation did not ‘force Catholic adoption agencies to close’ – it was the threat of having to fund the work themselves that forced closure.

  39. S.U. says:

    As a P.S. to my post above, I do think it is a good definition of irony: the fact that the greatest opponent of free speech, freedom of religion and freedom per se, has been the Catholic Church for much of its history.

    And when you read blogs such as http://protectthepope.com, it is easy to see why fascism has found fertile ground in many a Catholic country…

  40. Broga says:

    @S.U. : Fascism has also found fertile ground in the Vatican. I have just been reading “Hitler’s Pope: the secret history of Pius X11″ by John Cornwell. Cornwell began his research thinking it would vindicate Pius and in applying to the Vatican for access to documents he assured them that “I was on the side of my subject.” He was to be sadly disillusioned by Pius, so useful to Hitler, and so ready to quiet any Catholic concerns about the Fuhrer.

    In his review, typical of others, Peter Stanford of the “Sunday Times” wrote, “A superb work of objective and rigorous scholarship …….It will surely condemn a deeply flawed and profoundly unattractive character for ever.”

    I this the Vatican is intending to make Pius into a saint.