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Gay marriage proving deadly for African Christians

Gay marriage proving deadly for African Christians

CHRISTIANS in Africa are being massacred because of growing acceptance of gay unions in the West.

This astonishing claim was made by the Archbishop of Canterbury during a phone-in programme on LBC Radio.

Justin Welby

Justin Welby

Justin Welby said he had stood by a mass grave in Nigeria of 330 Christians who had been massacred by neighbours who had justified the atrocity by saying:

If we leave a Christian community here we will all be made to become homosexual and so we will kill all the Christians.

Who are these “neighbours”? Welby didn’t elaborate, simply saying:

I have stood by gravesides in Africa of a group of Christians who had been attacked because of something that had happened in America. We have to listen to that. We have to be aware of the fact.

Welby said warned that if the Church of England were to celebrate gay marriages:

The impact of that on Christians far from here, in South Sudan, Pakistan, Nigeria and other places would be absolutely catastrophic. Everything we say here goes round the world.

The Guardian says that this reasoning has until now been kept private, although both Welby and his predecessor, Rowan Williams, anguished about it in private.

Welby also condemned homophobia in England, saying:

To treat every human being with equal importance and dignity is a fundamental part of being a Christian.

Although he continued to uphold what he called the historic position of the church, of “sex only within marriage and marriage only between a man and a woman”, he agreed with the presenter, James O’Brien, that it was “completely unacceptable” for the church to condemn homosexual people more than adulterous heterosexual people.

African churches do not share this opinion, and the Anglican churches in both Uganda and Nigeria have given enthusiastic backing to laws which criminalise even the expression of support for gay marriage.

Hat tip: Trevor Blake

30 Responses to “Gay marriage proving deadly for African Christians”

  1. L.Long says:

    This load of STUPID is just too much for words!!
    I do what is right and some other psychotic kills like minded people and that is my fault?!?!?!?!
    Justin Welby can take his BS and shovel it right back up his butt!!!

  2. Ugh! It’s not so black and white, this one (pardon the phraseology).

    If the legalisation of gay marriage has genuinely given an excuse to the islamofascists to commit what is tantamount to genocide, it would give one pause for thought.

    It would make me uncomfortable if (fishing round for a metaphor) I were to, say, proclaim my existence as an atheist, and have a religious nutcase of whatever stripe commit acts of mass murder and publicly proclaim the reason as being specifically because of my announcement of my position.

    Sorry, but I sympathise with the xtians in this instance — and in particular, sympathise with *anyone* on the wrong side of the blood-bath in Nigeria.

    It’s always Africa. Might this be because there are too many people scrabbling around for a seriously limited pool of resources? Such may be the true reason, but religion becomes the motivator.

  3. Angela_K says:

    This speculative situation exists because the jackboots of Christianity have been stomping all over parts of the World that should have been left alone; we now see islam doing the same thing, but with added barbarism.

  4. Religious barbarism, be it nmuslim or christian, has only itself to blame

  5. jay says:

    Why don’t we see this? He’s trying to help the gays! He doesn’t want to do that! (sarcssm/off)

    Just like atheists and their lurid cartoons are causing Muslims to kill people in Afghanistan.

  6. This is tragic, nutcase barbarians finding excuses for their crimuinal behaviour, they kill christiams because they’re not muslims, stop. Christians oppress gays in Uganda ans other countries of Africa, so do muslims all over the world. Religious fundamentalism is the cancer if the world. Let’s not blame the victims, as usual.

  7. Brian Jordan says:

    Handwashing in the extreme, to imply that gay marriage is strictly American. Haven’t his bishops in the House of Lords told him that it’s now authorised in the UK? Will it take two of his priests to marry each other before he cottons on?
    Oh, and who are these people who are so murderously upset by it all? Doesn’t he know that either?

  8. If a psycopath says “if you do so and so I’ll kill people!”, the one to blame is the psychopath, not you. Obvious.

  9. 1859 says:

    It’s almost as if the ‘non-xtians’ are waiting for any ‘valid’ excuse to initiate genocide?

    If islamists perceive xtians as tolerating gay people, what will come out of their mouths is that xtians are ‘promoting’ the gay life style, so it follows that all xtians, all infidels are therefore gay and need to be wiped out. Oh shit, the religion of peace, tolerance and jihad…wonderful.

    I dunno….kick me in the arse if I’m wrong, but this is 2014?… Or did I wake up on this beautiful sunny Saturday morning in 1402?

  10. Canada Dave says:

    Don’t forget what we are talking about here….religion…these people carry out these atrocities based on how they are told to think and behave from a 1800 year old book.
    Is not the reactions that are at fault here it is the “basis” for the thoughts that lead to the reactions.

    Hitch was right….Religion poisons everything.

  11. Robster says:

    Is it unusual to have competing cults in the various mainstream churches stabbing each other in the back? Like everyone else, the Africans can develop their own crazy version of the christian nonsense that exactly reflects their values and watch as their quality of life deteriorates further.

  12. charlie says:

    What a load of crap. The killer is responsible for his/her acts. This is buck passing of the most vile sort.

  13. barriejohn says:

    If the following report is to be belived, Welby should be more worried about his son becoming involved with international criminals:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2594735/SEBASTIAN-SHAKESPEARE-Archbishop-Welbys-son-given-plum-job-Blair.html

  14. barriejohn says:

    As an aside: the BBC are reporting today that a female Afghan minister has appeared on television showing her face in an effort to get more women to vote. Yesterday there was a report on Afghan women joining the police force. I take my hat off to these people, because I think that they show more courage than perhaps I would in similar circumstances!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-26893972

    (PS Sad news on that site: Bob Larbey has died. He had a Good Life!)

  15. Speedy says:

    Welby just does not see it does he? It is what he stands for, what he himself promotes, what his job is all about, from which he earns his daily bread that is the root of the problem. The problem is religion. RELIGION IS THE PROBLEM. And such gargantuan conceit. Does he really think what the CoE does in the uk will be noticed by the stupefied befuddled uneducated superstitious credulous semi primitive hoards of large swathes of Africa.The man is either a fool or a liar. And if he is a liar then he must consider the population of the uk to be fools. The opposing forces of islam and christianity are at each other’s throats not to enlighten Africa but to suppress and exert power over its people with the sole aim of keeping the people poor while the theocrats and huckster evangelical preachers rob the cash and get rich. That’s what the pious are doing. They are fighting over wealth and power for themselves. And the bling laden swaggering rayban mobster politicians are in there too stirring it all up and siphoning off the dosh into their offshore megaloot bank accounts. Wonderful country Africa. Pity about the opposed forces of god who are destroying all hope and opportunity for improvement and development. Mr Welby please do me the courtesy of attending to your sad diminishing flock of aging jam making WI sunday best village dwelling marks and spencer flock and keep your crass views up your cassock.

  16. John C says:

    The massacres in Africa are the work of isloonatics,but it would take some balls to speak the truth,so a scapegoat must be found.

  17. “If a psycopath says “if you do so and so I’ll kill people!”, the one to blame is the psychopath, not you. Obvious.”

    Well yes, but if it’s other people the psychopath is killing, and nobody is able to stop him but you, by refraining from acting upon your freedom, it puts one in a moral predicament.

    If, by performing an act or espousing a belief which is perfectly legal and moral, this inspires someone else to act in a manner which is violent and destructive, then desipte the fact that you are morally “in the right”, you are still (indirectly) responsible for the violence and destruction.

    I’m sorry, but this is a really nasty one that should have students of moral philosophy up all night arguing. It’s one that does give me cause to think.

    The fact that it’s Nigeria, a notoriously unpleasant place to be politically, gives one a little distance from the situation — but look what happens in Russia and Greece (what *is* happening in Greece?) where the fascists are roaming the streets in bands beating up gays. We are not that far away from that in the US and Britain (although in Britain it’s more likely to be asylum-seekers, benefit recipients and the disabled than gays).

    The following options exist: a) to rally round and try and get some support for a force specifically designed to stop such atrocities as Boko Haram, Golden Dawn and the Neo-Cossacks (which in practical realpolitikal terms means “go to war”), b) to appease these forces of fascism by backing down and saying “sorry”, c) do nothing and ignore it because it’s happening a long way away, or d) to snipe on the sidelines and be rude to people who are raising these issues (the latter option being easiest if you are philosophically opposed to the person raising them), attacking them with ad hominem and tu quoque arguments.

  18. barriejohn says:

    The question is, surely: does capitulating in the face of the threat of violence by refusing to give equal respect to gay people disempower those making the threats, and I know what my answer to that would be. It may be a dilemma, but there should only be one option for the church.

  19. Robert Stovold says:

    Can’t have Christians rocking the boat, or worrying about what other might think, now can we?
    “I have come to turn “‘a man against his father, a daughter against her mother… a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household” (Matthew 10:35-6)
    “Everyone will hate you because of me” (Mark 13:13).

  20. andym says:

    All this seems to ignore gay people living in Africa. Elsewhere gay rights weren’t gained by keeping quiet and hoping homophobia would go away-will it be any different there?

    I don’t think any rights have been gained by victims keeping quiet.For instance, Christians are still congratulating themselves on “abolishing” slavery in the British empire. Most analyses miss the role of slave rebellions in the West Indies which were making the slave system unmanageable.

  21. Broga says:

    Justin Welby said about gay marriage,

    ‘It’s something that I wrestle with every day and often in the middle of the night.’

    What occurs to me is that he is unable to get his God, or his bible, to tell him what he should think and do. If he, as head honcho of the C. of E., can’t discover what his God wants then what confidence can anyone have in what he says. He might also wonder at the lack of protection offered by his God to the murdered Christians who, I assume, were devout and, as the phrase has it, “prayerful.”

    I noticed that he got a call from Widders on his phone in. She, with her usual brazen approach, said the C. of E. and presumably Welby didn’t know what they thought about anything. She on the other hand is certain. The trouble there is that what she is certain off is wrong.

    Welby should be concerned about, and offering some prayers, for his son who seems to have fallen into bad company. That young man needs serious paternal guidance. (Thanks for the reference barriejohn.)

  22. Stuart H. says:

    Of course, he might have been standing by the graves of gay African Christians, and “something in America” could be the loathsome Scott Lively, or Franklin Graham..or any other Christofascist American loon looking to make a few bucks (I almost said a killing) in Africa…..
    …but he probably wasn’t, because he’s as hypocritical as his fellow freeloaders in the Lords, and doesn’t care much about anything as long as he can sit on those benches, half-asleep and calculating how much per minute the UK public are paying him to do it.

  23. E Thompson says:

    If the Archbishop’s predecessors had taken this line, they would have stayed in the Roman Catholic Church to avoid the death of those Anglican martyrs burned by Mary I.
    And vice versa for the RCs whose co-religionists were burned by Protestants, of course.

  24. Broga says:

    @E Thompson: Burning those who have a different religion, or none, is so convenient and satisfying. It saves the trouble of thinking and the Christian sadists enjoy contemplating their opponents suffering in hell.

  25. gedediah says:

    It’s not just unacceptable for the church to condemn homosexuality more than adultery. It’s unacceptable to equate the two at all.

    Adultery is deception, whereas, there’s nothing wrong with being gay.

  26. […] African Christians will be killed if the Church of England accepts gay marriage. According to the Freethinker, he claimed he had stood by a mass grave in Nigeria of 330 Christians who had been massacred by […]

  27. Roger Cole says:

    Well, the Anglican church will not marry gay people nor will it ever it looks like so you can fold your tent and go to another denomination.

  28. […] From Barry Duke at the Freethinker: […]

  29. Broga says:

    The Archbishop is between a rock and a hard place. Whatever he wants he will find vociferous, if not vicious, opposition from a section of his flock. No amount of praying for guidance from his God, or scrutinising the inerrant words of his holy book, provides him with guidance of such clarity that they all know what to do and think.

    I think the intelligent clergy are atheists but they need to earn a crust somehow and for most of them prating about religion is all they know. I would like one of them, anonymously, to come on here and admit it and discuss his/her stresses. That could be cathartic.